ESC Hobbywing Hv130a V4 Setting Up

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Hi All,

Looks like I'm ready to connect some juice through to my ESC's (two for my Velos-Rotors 880) and am looking through the instructions, my goodness is the text small!

I need to decide what to do for the best as I've decided to go for mixing via the Rx. (Jeti DC-14) rather than a 'Y' cable arrangement as it seems like the best option to give full redundancy as V-R claim is a big plus arising from the design with two motors. The Hobbywing instructions mention the VBar FBL System and I'm using SpiritPro so this doesn't provide me any insight at all.

My questions are:
1. Should I approach this as though it was for two totally separate units and set up the mixing subsequently
2. Will I need to purchase a program box (I have an Align box) or purchase the WiFi Express module
3. If item #1 answer is do it as separate units, does this also mean setting each ESC/Radio calibration in the same manner

Thanks for any feedback given
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Providing you are not intending to use the Spirit's own governor function then if you wanted to use two independent throttle leads direct to the Rx is should be possible without mixes. What you can do (I think) is assign throttle channel to two separate pin outputs in your receiver (say pin 1 and pin 2). This should mean that you can just plug the throttle leads from the two ESC's into Rx pins 1 and 2. The throttle output on the FBL would now be 'spare' but could be used as a slot to plug in the second auxiliary BEC cable from the second ESC, so it works simply to receive BEC power.

I did something similar to this with my TDR2 for the retractable landing gear. I set the channel that i wanted to use for the landing gear to a pin on the Rx and plugged in the retract unit to that pin, it worked fine. I've just checked on one of my receivers and it is possible to assign the same channel to two separate pins on the Rx, so it 'should' work.

The Align program box should also work with the HW ESCs... Try it and see but i seem to recall i successfully used the Align box with HW ESCs before.

Setting up should straightforward. Basically set both ESC's with identical settings using the programming box, then calibrate throttle end points and do the gov store calibration as per normal, as if it were a single ESC.
 
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Smoggie

Well-Known Member
PS.. There are two versions of the HW 130A, one with BEC and one without (a.k.a. 'OPTO'). I'm assuming in the above discussion that both ESC's are the model with built in BEC**** However if they are the OPTO version then it works much the same but you wouldn't use the auxiliary BEC cables.

****Note that it might not in any case be a good idea to use two BEC equipped ESCs because the BECs may 'fight' each other and cause reverse current into the 'losing' ESC possibly damaging it. It would probably be best to use one ESC 'with BEC' and the other one OPTO... Or alternatively two OPTO and power the electronics from a battery or stand alone BEC.

On a heli of this size and value a backup system is very much a good idea. Optiguard or similar.
 
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Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Hi Steve, thanks for the quick response. Both units are the same non-OPTO versions. The V-R instructions give two options for ESC wiring i.e. a 'Y' cable and external RPM control and a channel mixing option. Channel mixing is anyway for me new territory so I'll need to look into this, too.

Before I 'light-up' the ESC's, I wanted to publish here to give the members the opportunity of sharing the learning experience and protect my ESC's from any ham-fisted action by myself.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Phil,

When you say 'non-OPTO' do you mean that they both are the type with the BEC?

Essentially the procedure I outlined above is equivalent to channel mixing, but instead of actually mixing channels you are taking advantage of the programming features of the Jeti Rx to output the same channel onto two pins. Thinking about it further, my only concern in doing it this way (or if using a conventional 'mix') is that you may not get exactly equal load distribution to both ESC/motors systems. If there was even a tiny difference in the calibrated governor RPM of each ESC then one would do the lion's share of the work and the other would be 'along for the ride'.

It may actually be better to use the Y lead method and the Spirit's own governor function. That way both ESC's should share load equally as their governed RPM will be exactly matched.

You could try it and see, check each motor temperature after flight to ensure each was doing a reasonably fair share of the work.
 
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Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Hi Steve,

The instructions are for both types, the text on the unit doesn't mention 'OPTO' and there's nothing that specifically identifies what the difference is. However, there are two ports under the three motor supply cables that are identified as '- + R' for BEC and '- + S' for throttle signal cable connections. So by default I'm of the opinion that they aren't 'OPTO'. The side port with '- + P' is for the external connection for the program box or the WiFi module.

Picking up on your earlier point of backup power, there are already two separate 12S power supplies and each motor is supposedly capable of landing the model if one side fails. As I see it, using the 'Y' cable route with yet another battery is somewhat OTT. I was thinking along the lines of connecting one system to the Rx. and the other to the Spirit Pro and the mixing doing the job of synchronisation.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
You need to know which version of the ESC you have got. If it’s the OPTO then it doesn’t have a BEc, so it has no voltage supply to the receiver so the receiver and FBL simply won’t work.

the OOTO version has ‘OPTO’ marked on the side, and the BEC version is marked ‘Super BEC’ (see attached pic)

the backup is nothing to do with the batteries. It’s a backup to the power supply to the receiver and FBL. If that fails it’s curtains

.1C7195E9-4C5D-4118-9DE9-5A69E3E4AFC1.png
 

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
As per the photo I have two. I'll knock up a wiring diagram of the proposed setup, I'm still not convinced that there's need for a third option for power supply.
 

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Wiring diagram attached. The link wire (Blue) between the Rx. and the SpitPro provides the backup power supply if one set fails, I don't see a need for a 5th battery. According to the ESC instructions, there is also the option to fit a capacitor to each ESC.
 

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Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Wiring diagram attached. The link wire (Blue) between the Rx. and the SpitPro provides the backup power supply if one set fails, I don't see a need for a 5th battery. According to the ESC instructions, there is also the option to fit a capacitor to each ESC.

Phil,
With the Hobbywing (BEC equipped versions) 130A ESC you are not supposed to connect a second BEC input in parallel with the first. This is because the BEC in the 130A ESC has no protection from reverse current flow. If wired up as shown it could potentially damage one or both ESCs. Hobbywing 'fixed' this issue with their 200A V4.1 ESC by adding reverse flow protection, but that modification hasn't yet made it's way into the 130A. It might be ok as both BECs should be putting out almost identical voltage, but I personally wouldn't like to risk it.

Having done some head scratching, I think the best solution in this case would be to use a couple of Optipower BEC-Guards. the BEC-Guard adds reverse current protection to ESCs that dont have it: Optipower BEC-GUARD Plug & Play Protection OPRBG001 You would need one per ESC.
 

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Hi all,

Latest version of my proposed wiring arrangement with input from my local model shop, all feedback appreciated.
 

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  • Velos Rotors Wiring.jpg
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Smoggie

Well-Known Member
That will work fine:)

I've got a spare Ultraguard if you need one. It needs a new battery but otherwise it's like new hardly used. The battery went bad in storage.
 

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Hi Steve, thanks for the thumbs-up. I've already bought the Ultraguard from Scamora (a thank you for the advice). Electronics is my weakest connection in the skill set :bellyroll: and it took me a little while to sort out the wiring during a busy time. The build continues today with DoR checks on the motors followed by the next phase of tail construction when it will begin to challenge my corner of the hobby room for space :twothumbsup:
 

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Hi all, the DoR tests worked out fine. One motor needed to be reversed the other was ok as it was. As the two motors began to accelerate there was a nasty screeching noise so power off immediately :damnit:.

Further investigation showed that the top flanges of both drive pulleys were touching the motor holding screws. Fortunately, nothing serious but I spent some time removing them and tidying up the damage. Both pulleys will now slip right up to the mounting plate without touching the screws. I'm not sure if this will completely clear the problem when I next do a test. I've set the pulleys slightly lower down the shafts giving a little more clearance but the drive belts are sitting lower on the larger gear wheel that I'd call the transfer shaft as it takes the drive into the gearbox. I'm toying with the idea to get hold of some shims to line everything up better as the drive belt isn't centered on the wheel now as per the manual. That was the cause of the clash in the first place, let's see.

Back to the main build thread now that the wiring's sorted :arms:
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
What heads are on the screws? If they are conventional cap head screws then use some button heads, they are lower profile. Most motors use button head screws for this reason.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Careful that the screws aren't too long. If too long they can stick through the baseplate of the motor and rub on the winding wires, possibly causing a short. Ideally they should be flush with the top of the beseplate of the motor.
 

Heliman450

Well-Known Member
Aaaargh, my bad! There are 4 x 8 mm Button-head screws shown per motor. Fortunately, no serious harm done apart from major embarrassment.
 
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