Micro New problems with 130x.

[xokia]

I think you guys are missing the point. The small torque tube gear seperates from the torque tube shaft. This creates back and forth play on the shaft. So when the motor spins up it shoves the torque tube shaft to the rear of the helicopter which in turn shoves the torque tube gear into the rudder gear which is riding on that small bearing.

This is why I believe when people replace the tail box they remove that torque tube gear replace the tailbox and then shove the torque tube gear all the way back on (Which is what is really fixing the problem).

If you look at a set of Boca bearings and a set of stock bearings both are sealed signifacantly better than the Rakon bearings. Rakons are completely open from what I can tell. But I dont think that is the issues. Those bearing were intended to support the rudder only. Not the motor pushing the gears into them.

I'll take pictures once I get the parts hopefully that clears things up. I had to order them my local hobby store was out of the tail gears. I stuck my one good stock bearing on the rudder side. So if it's going to wear out it will do it quickly.

 

[coolgabsi]

130x tail discussion - YouTube
It was very windy.. Sorry you'll have to concentrate lol

Where I say tail hub I mean tail box

And yes I testedy bird's metal in this wind.. 5 batteries flown! About 7 crashes right after this video.. All I broke was the tail fin

While the cyclic is was steady but the tail was fighting hard. It was giving in by about 45 degrees going tail in hurricanes .. But that's not bad considering the wind
Fly safe!! have fun!

 

[xokia]

Hey I watched some of it but then it got to windy and I couldnt understand everything but I think we are on the same page now. I watched until 2:48 so if I missed something sorry.

My real name is Mike. The Xokia name is rather stupid I had a nokia phone at the time and I suck at picking names so just added X instead on N I've seen xokia used in other places that aren't me. No idea how people choose those. I'm nsxxtreme on a lot of other forums. That was because I own an Acura NSX. My name picks are stupidly simple.

Anyway yea my torque tube is sloppy like that and slides back and forth. About the same amount as yours in the video. I pushed that gear back onto the shaft. On mine the shaft doesnt stick out of the end of the gear like yours with it fully seated. I suspect that has to do with how the tail box gets mounted. I have 0 slop in mine now. Once I get my rudder gear I'll post some pictures and then start flying the thing and see how it hold up. I have a microheli tail box as a back up if the stock tail box eats another set of bearings.

 

[coolgabsi]

That's what address towards the end .. Slop is good as it lets the tt find a sweet spot as the front gears don't push your tt back on the back tt shaft.

Zero slop and right gear mesh and gear pushed all the way in :BAD

Fly safe!! have fun!

 

[xokia]

I'll have to try and watch the rest of that later. Gears under load will try and seperate from each other. The only way for that to happen is to shove the TT shaft backwards.

Maybe I am wrong I dont mind admitting it if that turns out to be the case. I did not check the play in that TT shaft when it was first out of the box. I have a set of bearings to try this out on so I will know rather quickly. The fact the Boca's wore out in 3 flights tells me its more then just the tail box (at least in my mind).

 

[coolgabsi]

You're right the gears in stress will push the ooppsote way.. But don't forget the front gears they are both metal and bigger and have a higher tendency to push things back!! That's what we are trying to prevent from happening. So if there is a good anoint of play ok both ends, the torque tube will find a good sweet spot in the middle when running in load.. see what I am saying... You were perfectly correct considering the rear torque tubes.. But we got a another set of gears in the front

Fly safe!! have fun!

 

[xokia]

This feels like work lol. The front gears are what are providing the rearward force since they have a motor powering them. The rear gears must counteract that force. And the only thing to do that is the rear tail bearings. Thus putting extra load on those bearings.

If the slop is taken out, the rearward force from the torque tube shaft trying to separate from the main gear is placed on the torque tube bearings instead of the tail bearings.

Which your video I would say kinda points in my favor. If the rear gears were pushing back then those wear marks wouldn't be on that tail shaft.
The motor was driving that torque tube shaft into your tail shaft. Which I would speculate is what is saving your bearings the force is being distributed evenly across both bearings since its hitting in the middle. Where as if it weren't hitting that tail shaft the force would be primarily placed on the side with the rudder gear.

I'll ad a caviat that I'm not an mechanical engineer though

 

[coolgabsi]

yeah.. kinda.... but yes the front ones are pushing the tt back.. but only if they are too tight.. Mine are loose so yes the load is distributed and I keep my Tt floating..

regardless.. I dont want this to become work for you AND me heehee.. i am not mechanical engineer either.. wish we were face to face.. so much eaasier.. haha I hate writing

 

[xokia]

I didn't mean that in a disrepectful way. The back and forth is useful information and that's all I was getting at.
I should have my new gears by this saturday I think, and I have 10 batteries to run through it. So once I replace the gear I lost I'll put it through its paces and report back my findings. Either the bearing will hold up or they will quickly wear out like the Boca's did.

 

[coolgabsi]

Ohh no please don't worry. I didn't Trae it disrespectfully


Hey we are engineers RCA is fun!!

Fly safe!! have fun!

 

[xokia]

I think I am making progress here. Found the rear torque tube gear stripped. What is crazy is that it would run fine and hover fly around some, turn left/right just fine. But if you really needed the rudder power it would start slipping then spiral out of control. So that was the hard part figuring out why the rudder wasn't functioning correctly. I think the spiral problem is finally solved!!!!!

Old bearings seem to be holding up. I put the red O-rings on and now my head wobble is gone. Now the tail kinda pulsates slightly and the tail will shake on the way up if I go from mid stick to full stick. Not sure what is causing this. Also I still think the motor still seems a little weak.

 

[xokia]

So I put the Rakon bearings in and they are significantly better than the Boca's. So much so that I wouldn't even consider buying the Boca's again. That pretty much resolved my issues.

Since I had the microheli tail I stuck it on anyway. Coolgabsi notice the aluminum space behind the torque tube gear to remove the slack. Its part 152506AS I still say if your running the stock tail box that gear needs to be shoved back all the way to remove all back and forth slack if you expect your bearings to last.
I would not buy stock bearings I would get the Rakons.

 

[xokia]

Coolgabsi do you have a picture of your motor in the 130x. Can you post it in here if you don't have it posted somewhere else already? I'm hesitant to spend $40 on the same stock motor.

 

[heli-maniac]

i think he has a picture in his 130 x thread
TMK has both the spin 8000 and the hp08 that he has for 36.00
his hp08 shows to have lots of power over stock motor
im going to go with the spin 8000 on mine here soon just spent my money on a charger i bought from Gaba so now i have to wait on more funs

 

[xokia]

New update so I have had my hp08 in the helicopter for a while now and it's been great but I keep stripping main gears. The solid carbon main shaft has worked great and I no longer crack main shafts.

So I ordered a microheli main gear with one way bearing and hopefully that resolves my problem with stripped main gears. I also got rid of the microheli tail. I really dont like that little washer they have behind the gear. It's tiny and easy to lose when swapping gears. So I just stuck the stock tail back on there with a micro heli tail slider, and Rakon bearings. So far its been working great.

One thing I found is that I have been having so much fun doing flips and rolls that I have been getting lazzy at just the normal orientations. So this weekend I resisted doing flips and just practiced flying around. I saved the last battery out of 10 to do 3D. I was sigificantly better by that 10th battery. So I think I will resist 3D flight and save that for last from now on and just keep getting better with orientation.

 

[coolgabsi]

NICE! how is the tail holding on high pitch and cyclic manuevers on Idle up 2 ?

 

[xokia]

NICE! how is the tail holding on high pitch and cyclic manuevers on Idle up 2 ?

Cyclic it holds up fine. However if I get into a rough spot and give it a lot of collective I can get it to blow out. But at that point I'm bogging the motor pretty badly so I know its me not the helicopter.

I purchased the gear and one way that should work with my solid carbon shaft. I notice the other version uses a metal main shaft. My only worry their is weight and having it bend. Do any of you have the metal main shaft?
How is it holding up? It's looking like micro heli is discontinuing the version that works with the solid main shaft and going towards metal.

 

[coolgabsi]

Jesse likes his apparently


I tried those on my mcpx and the first crash they bent so I never even tried on the 130


You still using the stock tail servo?

Fly safe!! have fun!

 

[FlightlessBird]

I'm starting to get the idea this heli has a fair amount of problems. Am I reading too much into this?

 

[coolgabsi]

I'm starting to get the idea this heli has a fair amount of problems. Am I reading too much into this?

It has issues if dealt with like a micro bird like mcpx or msr.

If dealt like and take. Care like a full size heli say 450 this bird is AMAZING!!

Does need a few upgrades. About a 100 bucks worth ... I bought used cheaper than sale price android upgrades haha

But ... I love it !!

Fly safe!! have fun!