Who's Into Saltwater?

[Tony]

Thanks Kyle. The wife was actually out there helping me the whole time I was making it. It was pretty fun. I have done quite a bit more than what is shown in the pictures, but all I have to do now is make probe holders and weld them in, and make a permanent float level sensor and put it in as well. Two pieces, and this thing is ready for a leak test. I may change clothes when I get home and head out to the garage and make them real quick. Tape them in and put the solvent on and let it cure. The biggest thing that I have left is making the top rail to help support the walls of the sump when it's full of water. It will also hold the two drains for the filter socks and one for the inlet for the refugium. The top brace will be the hardest piece to make since I want to put so much into it. But once this thing is done, and if it doesn't leak and break apart when I fill it up, it should help stabilize the tank a LOT. But, still a lot to do before that happens.

 

[Tony]

Alright, here is a little update on the tank.

As I posted before, I have been building a new sump for the tank to not only add a large refugium, but to also add more volume to the tank. This was a new kind of project for me as I have never worked with acrylic before. After purchasing a new table saw and router, things started to go a LOT smoother. After the nano cube trial and error, I started the sump build as you have seen. Well last weekend I finally installed the last piece, the support for the top of the sump. without this support, the tank would bow out and could possibly crack. So I decided to put a 2" lip all the way around the sump. The parts where there is a bulkhead are 3". The picture below shows the sump upside down right after welding the top to the sump rim. The blue tape is where I cut the sump lip with a router.



After letting it cure for 24 hours, the welding should have been at 80% strength. So with that, it was time to do some water testing. So I put it on some foam, grabbed the water hose and started filling it up. Little did I know, it takes a WHILE to fill this thing up lmao. First was the first chamber where the water comes in. It's a small chamber, but it held water perfectly. That spills over to the second chamber after going through the filter socks. Again, held like a charm. Then that chamber goes into #3 which is the return where the heater and ATO will be placed, again, it held perfectly. the I filled up chamber #4 which is the refugium. This one fills ALL the way up and only leaves 1" of space at the top because of the fingers. I filled that one up where it was over flowing into chamber #2 and noticed a bow in the wall between #4 and #3. It wasn't bad, but could cause issues down teh road. Again, there are no leaks. So I filled the whole thing up to within 1" of the rim to put the max amount of pressure on the outside walls. Again, held perfectly and not a single leak. Pretty good for my first time EVER working with acrylic.

Because of the bowing in the #4 chamber, I decided to put a 1.5" brace across the top of it. Cut it out and had it installed in about 10 minutes. I didn't feel that I needed to wait to install the sump, so talked to the wife and we decided to install it. the problem was, we didn't have all of the fittings to plumb it like it should be plumbed. However, I had enough to put it under there and get it working. So we started trying to think about how we were going to do it.

My thought was to remove the center brace from teh front of the tank. That way, we could just slide it straight in, put the brace back and be done with it. Yeah well, they put nails through the top and bottom as well as from the inside so there is NO WAY I was going to get this piece out. And I tried lmao. So, we cleared out the stand where only the sump was left that we were going to take out. Below is a picture of the BEFORE with the old sump.



After cleaning that out, we brought in the 55 gallon barrel and a 55 gallon aquarium to put the water in from the 90. As you can see in the picture below, we took out a LOT of the water and the fish were PISSED lol.



Well the plan was to have the wife and I slide out the tank and stand so that we could access it from the back. Well, she could not move it, so I had to move it by myself. This thing still weighed over 500lbs even though we took out a lot of the water. But, I finally got the tank pulled out.



From there, I removed the center brace from the back of the stand which was a LOT easier than the front lol. Then we drained the old sump and took it out. After doing some cleaning, we tried fitting the new sump into the stand. We found out that there were two pressure points where I made the sump just a little too big. But, I decided to press on and I will fix those issues later. So, we got the sump in and sitting on the Styrofoam for protection and I installed the brace that I took out. This was NOT fun lmao. From there, I started putting the plumbing back into the tank where we could kick it all back on. At this time, the water was cooling off way faster than I though it would and the fish and corals were starting to get pretty mad. So we pushed the tank back and pumped fresh salt water into the sump where I thought the level should be, then we started filling the tank up with teh water we took out earlier. After getting the tank back up and running, below is what we ended up with.




There is still quite a bit of room on the sides, but I could not make the sump any bigger. That dead space will be used though. There is about 5" side to side, 15" front to back, and from teh sump to the top of the stand is about 14". So, that is the size that I'm going to make my ATO container to hold the top off water. I can still lift it out to clean it, but it will be a perfect fit and should blend right in. This I still have to make though. Shouldn't be hard to do.

Now for what I have been waiting for since i put the tank up. Usually when you put something that is under water otu in the air, like when you drain over 66% of the water, usually kills things lol. Well, the NEXT DAY something popped up that I did not expect. Yes, 24 hours is all ti took for this to pop up. It's CORALLINE ALGAE!!! This is orange algae, but dammit, it's coralline algae! Now that the orange is growing, the purple is right behind it. This makes me happy.






So there you go, new sump, new very colorful algae and soon, a new ATO container. This was a good weekend for the tank!

 

[Tony]

Well, turns out that the coralline algae that I showed in the pictures was not. It's pretty much all gone now. Not sure why.

I did receive my new PH Probe yesterday though. I will be calibrating it when I get home and seeing if my PH still goes wacky when I plug in my lights to the Apex VDM. If it does, then there is another issues with the controller. If I have any more issues with this thing, I'm selling it and going back to mechanical timers. I'm tired of working on it and dealing with support from Neptune.

 

[Tony]

I installed new lights in the stand today. I only ran two strips on the top of the stand and I have them wired to a 12vDC (actually 16.4, but eh, whatever lol) power supply that is being controlled by the door switches through the Apex Controller. They are not as bright as I thought they would be, but I can always add more strips if I want more light. But this puts a good amount of light all over the stand and sump so I can see everything now lol.

I also decided to take some pictures of the tank just as an update. the Monti is doing great and is growing like crazy. I can't see the acro growing, but it seems happy as well. The colt is just doing it's thing, getting pissed off at anything that touches it, the green start are doing great, and pretty much everything else is doing great. Anyway, have a look at the pictures.

Here is the Monti. Growing like crazy


Here is the Acro which I wish would grow as fast as the monti lol.


Here is our newest coral, it's called a Pipe Organ.


Here is the Green Star Polyps. Again, doing great and growing like crazy!


Here is the Colt. Tempermental little son of a....


Here is the Green Stripped Shrooms. I think they are getting too much light and i need to move them lower in the tank.


Here are the Neon Green Shrooms. Again, I think they are getting too much light.


Here are my Zoo's. Not sure what there actual name is other than Zoo's.


Here is a shot of the GBA (Green Bubble Tip Anemone) having food stollen from it by a Peppermint Shrimp



And below are some shots of the sump area and the new lights. I do like the way it lights up now compared to the way it was.





Here you can see the area where the water flows into the sump and then into the filter socks.


Here you can see the PH Probe (Blue) and the ORP Probe (Red). If you have questions about ORP, ask callsign4223...


Here is a picture of my ATO (Auto Top Off) float switch. As you can see, it's a bit low but I'm still trying to fine tune the system for the best water level.


Here you can see the water level in the return section. Behind it is the refugim that I will be plumbing in when I get the parts this weekend.


And here are some full tank pictures.



Here is my Urchin. This little ******* has poked me about a dozen times now lmao


While I was on the floor, I took this picture.


And here is half of the wiring nightmare that I'm trying to clean up


Hope you enjoy the pictures.

 

[murankar]

Yes it was enjoyed, looks like a real reaf you would dive to see.

 

[Tony]

It still has a long way to go before getting to that point. The rocks will go from the dull that you see in these pictures, to the color that you saw in my last tank pictured below. It just takes months, if not years to get to the point of my old tank. I really regret getting rid of it now that I'm having to do it all over again.



However it has made a pretty good progression though. It was bleached white lol.

Before


Midway


Now

 

[murankar]

Still looking good anyways. Yes its a shame you had to start over again.

 

[Tony]

And callsign4223, if you see this post, the "before" picture is your tank!

 

[Karubah]

That tank looks absolutely fantastic Tony. Just a Q, what do you feed the corals on as I thought they feed on minute plankton?

 

[Tony]

You are right. I feed trace elements, Iodide, Calcium, Magnesium, phytoplankton, rotifers and the larger ones like the anemone, I feed them half a minnow or brine shrimp. But, they get most of their food from the algae that grows on them. This algae is also what gives them the color they are. From green to red, purple, orange, yellow and so on. This algae is called zooxanthellae, and it thrives under photosynthesis. But do better when you can feed phyto and zooplankton.

 

[Tony]

Wow, no responses from anyone on this. Guess this thread is losing it's interest.

Well guess what, I think I'm FINALLY finished with the sump. When I got off work friday morning, I headed straight to Lowes and picked up all of the fittings and pipe that I needed to finish the sump install. $70 later, I walked out of there lol. The plan was to just come home, go to bed and wake up early and get started on it. That was the plan...

Once I got home, I started laying things out on the table like I wanted them on teh sump. I was seeing that I didn't have what I needed. I know I double and triple checked everything before putting it in the cart. Ah well, keep fitting. About an hour later, I had the whole layout done and I knew exactly how it was going to go together. Let me tell you, even as big as it is down under the tank, I was running out of room fast for this plumbing. But I kept on.

Finally, I made the decision that I would just start on it and get it going. This was at about 0800. I usually go to sleep at 0900. I started with the drain from the tank into the sump. Simple, come down, 90 into a T that drops into the sump, goes over to the other inlet to the sump, 90 and down. Need to put a Union in there, that was a bit tricky but got it done.

Okay, the drain is done, now for the return. Let me tell you, this was a pain in teh butt to get done. It had to come up from the pump, over to the refugium then over to the tank to return to the outlet. It took me a good hour to lay all of this out and get it all glued up. But, I got it done. Things here are cut to within 1/16" of an inch. But, it was done.

The Tru-Union valve that is on the refugium was supposed to be on the main pump, but I picked up the wrong valve so had to swap them around at the last minute. Not a big deal, just wish it would have went different. Anyway, below are the pics of what I have going on with the sump at the time I FINALLY went to bed at 1300. Yeah, that late lmao.

Here is a shot of the whole stand just after instillation.


Here is a shot of the return back to the tank. As you can see, there is a bit going on here.


Here is a shot of the drain into the sump as well as the return to the tank.


Here you can see that the water is not near as turbulant as it was in the last pics.


This picture is just showing the water movement going from chamber #1 to chamber #2.


Here is another angle on the return plumbing. As you can see, it comes up from the pump into a 90, over to a corner 90 that drops down to a valve to regulate the refugium, then goes through a one way check valve, through a union to take it all apart then finally up into the tank.


I ended up stirring up a LOT of crap in the tank. The fish were just waking up and they were pissed lmao. Center left you can see my temp probe that I moved from the sump since I had no water flow through there. Center right on teh front glass is the heater, again for teh same reason.


If you mix the salt to what the manufacturer suggests, you will get a specific gravity of about 1.021. Well the corals that I keep want more salt than that. So, I'm running between 1.025-1.026. And the corals LOVE it.


fast forward to when I woke up at 1900, and I got started on it again. This time, it was installing the light, skimmer, fan, heater, probes, sand, macro, rocks and finally getting the refugium running. I had to mix up some new saltwater though. The sump is so big that I ran out of my supply while trying to fill it. I was about 10 gallons short. For those that don't remember, or have not read the whole thread, the sump will hold just over 40 gallons by it's self when full. Normal running, I'm at about 25-30 gallons.

Here are some pictures after I finished everything.

Again, here is a full stand shot with everything in the sump


Here is a shot of the return pump with the heater. The heater was placed to allow the heated water to immediately go into the tank and be more efficient.


Here is a shot of the left side. The skimmer for some reason ws not skimming like it should be, but as of the time of this post, it's doing what it's supposed to.


Here is another shot of the right side. You can see the refugium light that helps the Macro Algae grow as well as the fan that kicks on at 83ºF. You would be surprised at just how fast this fan cools the tank down.


Here is another shot of the inflow to the sump and the filter socks. Just because lol. I still can't believe at just how well this system works. And I designed it.


Here is a shot of the tubing that comes from the tank to the sump. This allows me to see if there is air in it. No air means I'm about to over flow the tank. As you can see by the white, there is plenty of air. It helps that I have the pump choked off a bit lol. It's a BIG pump.


Here is an upclose look at the heater. As you can see, 300 watts and working it's butt off to heat this tank up after being shut down for a few hours. However, I noticed a problem. Just below the label, you see some condensation. This is BAD! That is why I now have the top fo the heater out of the water. Just in case there is an electricity bleed.


This is the outflow from Chamber #3, the Refugium going back into Chamber #1. As you can see, it's not flowing that fast at all, and I have reduced it even more.


This shot shows some of the sand and rock of the refugium. I decided to go with about 2" of sand. The green rocks are out of the main display and the white rocks are out of a bucket that has been sitting outside for about 4 months. I will be adding more as the white rock cures.


This is the pipe that is supplying water into the Refugium. What is hard to see is it's sitting in a clear glass to force the water and bubbles back up. If you look close, you can see the bubbles at the bottom of the pipe, as well as one bubble that was rising just to the left of the pump. This keeps the sand and Macro Algae from being blown around. And, another piece of rock from the tank.


Here is a shot of the Chaeto Macro Algae. This is what helps suck out Nitrates and Phosphates from the water. Both of which are VERY BAD for fish and coral.


Here is a larger shot of the refugium. However, because water bends light, it looks more empty than it is. It's almost up to the lip that the black cased light is sitting on, by design.


Here is another shot of the Refugium. There is going to be all kinds of little critters in here very soon. I'm sure they are in there now, they were just hiding.


So that is where the tank sits as of now. I did get the new pH probe in and replaced it. Both Neptune Systems and I thought it was a probe issue causing the pH to rise when I plugged in my VDM and turned the lights on in the tank. After WEEKS of emailing, I was at the end of my rope. Paul, the support tech for Neptune, did everything he could to try and figure this issue out. So, frustrated with the friggin thing, I figured I had to have some kind of electricity bleed in the tank. Yes, the first thing I unplugged was the heater. No change.

So, I unplugged the skimmer, main pump, refugium light, stand light, power heads (one at a time) and nothing worked. Then I started to reach to the power strip to unplug the LED drivers one by one that power my main lights. That's when it hit me... Maybe it's with the power strip...?

I pulled the plug from the power strip out of the power bar on the Apex system and that is when I saw it. The ground pin on the plug was broken off. this resulted in no ground. And with something like these drivers that convert energy, you really need a grounding pin.

So I unplugged the drivers out of the power strip and plugged them into their own plug on the power bar. BOOM! Not a single change in pH. That was the answer all along. I sent Paul another email explaining what went on and what I found hoping that it would help both of us later on.

So now, the tank is on autopilot. Right? Yeah right lmao. I will find something else to do to it here soon lmao.

Now that all of that is done though, I can FINALLY get started on my Nano project. I can't wait!

 

[Graham Lawrie]

Brilliant Tony. A lot of time effort and hard work in there. I used to have 3 tanks, tropical way bback in my single days. Always fancied marine but very expensive. You have done a good job on this one.

 

[Tony]

It will only get better as time goes on. The corals are starting to grow rapidly and it's only a matter of time before the tank starts making some money. I can't wait.

I did think of something else that I need to do to the tank though lol. I need to make my ATO container. It's just a simple box to hold water with Kalk+2 in it. I think I will make that when I make my nano tank and weld them both together at the same time in the house.

I did get some work done on the RCH Heli though. I put some RCH decals on it as well as my name. I'm working on another file as well. But, that is a surprise hehe.

 

[callsign4223]

Looking good Tony, real good.

 

[wolfman76]

One of these days i will have my own tank i will have to use this thread as a point of reference... Good job Tony

 

[Tony]

Thanks Matt and Kyle. It was a lot of work, but it's worth it.

 

[murankar]

I have been following since day 1. All the hassles of dieing fish, cloudy water, bad salt and just about everything else that can go wrong. I have to say its become one hell of a tank(s). One thing I have not figured out is the purpose of the refungium (not sure if spell right) tank. Is this adding algae back into the main tank or is it to deplete the nitrates and such from the water?

Still though I hope that this tank endeavor pays off both in personal joy and financial.

 

[Tony]

Thanks for following URI. The Refugium's purpose is to provide a safe haven for the macro algae and copepods. Macro algae is not the algae you are thinking about that is slimy, Macro Algae like Chaetomorpha is more like a plant. It will suck out Nitrates and Phosphates from the water making the water cleaner and safer for the fish. The little copepods will eat just about anything and also help keep the tank clean. However, if they were in the main tank, they would be eaten by the fish quite quickly. The Chaeto would not get eaten as my tang just doesn't like it. But the little critters would be gone very fast. They will, at times, get thrown into the return chamber and pushed into the main tank for a snack for the fish.

You can also use the Refugium as an algae scrubber by not cleaning it, ever. Just let the hair algae and other algaes that you see in a normal tank grow. this will end up sucking out all the nutrients that algae needs and it will not grow in your main tank. That is the theory anyway and they have gotten it to work, but only with a LOT of light. I'm talking, take my LED's that are supporting SPS Corals and put it on the refugium. Perfect area for algae.

Hope that answers the question of what a Refugium is used for. It's just a safe haven. Ideally it would be 10x the size of your tank to work efficiently, but I don't have that luxury lol.

Now to the update from this weekend. I have built the ATO container and it's curing as I type this. My seams need to get a LOT better before I attempt to build anything of quality. Although my seams will and do hold water, I just hate seeing those little bubbles in it. Need to find out why they are forming. But, it's built, it's only made to hold top off water and will be under the tank.

What won't be under the tank is the Nano Project. It will be sitting on my desk with little fishies in it as well as small corals. But, more on that in the Nano Project thread.

 

[Tony]

Alright everyone, Here is the video that I have promised for a while. Showing how the sump works and everything that is going on with it.

Corrections in the video.

When talking about the Skimmer (the thing that makes bubbles), I say that it removes TDS, or Total Dissolved Solids. This is wrong. My DI resin in my ro/di system removes that. The skimmer removes DOC's, or Dissolved Organic Compounds.

Next I talk about not being able to see the micro bubbles. Well, I couldn't see them in the phone when recording, but you can see them in this video. Might have to kick on HD to see them though.

When talking about the refugium, I talk about the red algae and say it's because of the rock and "Salt". I meant to say Sand, not Salt. Both the white rock and sand were bleached so it's pretty much making a cycle again. But much faster this time.

I think that's it lol.

Enjoy and let me know what you think about my first ever sump build.

 

[Tony]

Hm, guess no one liked the video... Oh well.

Just had to throw out over 30 gallons of fresh saltwater. It went stagnant on me. Horrible smelling stuff I tell ya lol.

On a side note, the acro frag and the monti both are doing great. as is the rest of the stuff in the tank. Had to lower my light intensity though to keep most of them happy.