600 Airwolf 620 Build
- Thread starter billryalls
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billryalls
Member
The NAZA works with both flybar and FBL which is great since I'll be switching to FBL in the future. I might just paint it although my wife suggested cutting a circle out of bottom of tail and "inset" the gps up into that with hot glue and then paint it to match. Hmmm...
billryalls
Member
Updates (good and bad) Saturday 
billryalls
Member
Well my afore mentioned updates are a bit late as i have had nothing bud bad luck (noob knowledge) with this build. Getting very close and then having the hammer drop down and nearly crushing my dream project. Just as all the electrics were done, Naza, GPS on board and I was ready to start programming the Autopilot i made a HUGE mistake. I read that I needed to test the current coming from the esc to the receiver and servos. I touched the two probe ends to two receiver prongs (thinking this will tell me how much current is coming to the receiver and as suddenly as I touched them with the probe tips I heard a hiss and then a bumch of smoke come from my ESC. THAT QUICK! Well, after a bunch of testing I discovered that my $130 ALIGN ESC was toast and then later that my $150 9chan Spektrum Rx was toast as well. This was QUITE discouraging as even though I was very financially limited I waited to buy quality parts as all of you suggested (demanded? ). Well, I thought that was the end of the project till at least next year when family stepped in and provided me with a new receiver (orangerx 9chan), better than nothing I hope, and a Castle Talon 90. Due to my fear of blowing up my NAZA system (almost a $600 investment) I am completing this without it until I am proficient with all the basics. SO I have assembled everything but now have a very cheap receiver AND a very cheap GYRO as that is now needed without the NAZA system. My question right now is, I have been flying my HK450 with this same Rx/Gyro setup with no problems. Am I taking any unreasonable risk taking this expensive build up with these components (just basic scale flying) or should I bite the bullet and wait till I get a quality Rx and enough knowledge to proficiently install the NAZA?? Here is a pic of the new mechanics setup if I continue with the new components.
![IMG_7270[1].jpg](https://www.rc-help.com/data/attachments/7/7781-be6c485446f077576b713cd1a0797582.jpg "IMG_7270[1].jpg")
). Well, I thought that was the end of the project till at least next year when family stepped in and provided me with a new receiver (orangerx 9chan), better than nothing I hope, and a Castle Talon 90. Due to my fear of blowing up my NAZA system (almost a $600 investment) I am completing this without it until I am proficient with all the basics. SO I have assembled everything but now have a very cheap receiver AND a very cheap GYRO as that is now needed without the NAZA system. My question right now is, I have been flying my HK450 with this same Rx/Gyro setup with no problems. Am I taking any unreasonable risk taking this expensive build up with these components (just basic scale flying) or should I bite the bullet and wait till I get a quality Rx and enough knowledge to proficiently install the NAZA?? Here is a pic of the new mechanics setup if I continue with the new components.
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Stambo
Well-Known Member
Personally, I would be tempted to give it a go.
You obviously already know that the orangerx and your gyro are cheap units so probably have their limitations.
It would stand to reason that with all your investment thus far you will not do anything to risk it, baby steps.
I would first check to see if the gyro is listed as capable of controlling such a monster, then (carefully) go for it.
With the birds you already have experience with, going to a larger machine should not be too difficult.
The difference between my 450 and Trex 500 is huge.
With the problems people have setting up some flight controllers I would want to know that the bird actually flies ok before going to the next step of installing one.
But that's just my opinion.
You obviously already know that the orangerx and your gyro are cheap units so probably have their limitations.
It would stand to reason that with all your investment thus far you will not do anything to risk it, baby steps.
I would first check to see if the gyro is listed as capable of controlling such a monster, then (carefully) go for it.
With the birds you already have experience with, going to a larger machine should not be too difficult.
The difference between my 450 and Trex 500 is huge.
With the problems people have setting up some flight controllers I would want to know that the bird actually flies ok before going to the next step of installing one.
But that's just my opinion.
oy... current is measured in series with the given connection, not in parallel as you do with a voltage reading. There are small inline power meters you can put between the BEC and the Rx to determine total current draw. You test current draw of the servo setup by putting pressure on the swashplate while the system is powered up. They will fight your pressure. You keep it there for 3 minutes or so straight. If nothing overheats and goes into thermal shutdown you are pretty much safe. You can check the power meter for verification, but one isn't strictly necessary. I've done this kind of current draw/power handling test on all my big builds without use of a power meter and have had no problems.
By putting the meter across the two ports on the Rx you more or less dead shorted them. Poof. Magic smoke.
Sorry this happened to you. It's unfortunate it cost you as much as it did.
To your question: I'd personally be leery of trusting this model to an orange Rx. But if that's what budget allows so be it. Just make sure to do a range and control check before each flight.
By putting the meter across the two ports on the Rx you more or less dead shorted them. Poof. Magic smoke.
Sorry this happened to you. It's unfortunate it cost you as much as it did.
To your question: I'd personally be leery of trusting this model to an orange Rx. But if that's what budget allows so be it. Just make sure to do a range and control check before each flight.
billryalls
Member
Thanks for all the info Paul, but I gotta ask, when you put a bind plug on arent yuou doing the same thing??
Derek
Well-Known Member
That really sucks, Bill! I'm really sorry to hear about this. That's really great, though, that your family stepped up to help you out. Awesome!
In regard to the OrangeRx question...I have 4 OrangeRx's on 3 of my scratch built planes and 1 on my RC Snow Skidder. Let's take the Snow Skidder out of the story because I don't drive it very far away from me. Now...my other 3 planes...I have flown them so high that I have literally lost visual site of them. Then I shut the motor down and just let them float down, very well under control, and then I keep flying. I've not had any issues at all with my OrangeRx's losing signal. Me, personally, I wouldn't have any issues nor concerns about the OrangeRx on your helicopter. You are going to be flying "scale" and not very far out from you. I think you will be fine. Now, that being said, I know that there will be others that will disagree with me completely, and that's ok.
Curious...what tx are you using? Flybarred or Flybarless?
In regard to the OrangeRx question...I have 4 OrangeRx's on 3 of my scratch built planes and 1 on my RC Snow Skidder. Let's take the Snow Skidder out of the story because I don't drive it very far away from me. Now...my other 3 planes...I have flown them so high that I have literally lost visual site of them. Then I shut the motor down and just let them float down, very well under control, and then I keep flying. I've not had any issues at all with my OrangeRx's losing signal. Me, personally, I wouldn't have any issues nor concerns about the OrangeRx on your helicopter. You are going to be flying "scale" and not very far out from you. I think you will be fine. Now, that being said, I know that there will be others that will disagree with me completely, and that's ok.
Curious...what tx are you using? Flybarred or Flybarless?
A bind plug is connecting signal pin to ground pin (the two outside pins), this is safe since there is low current on the signal pin. The problem comes if you connect the two power pins (negative/ground pin to the positive pin). In that case it is a short and can lead to frying things if there is not circuit protection in place for it (built into the Rx, if it is there at all). In general you need to be very careful using tester probes on the output pins on an Rx or FBL or BEC, regardless of what mode your tester is in. It is very easy to slip off the intended pin and end up bridging pins. In current mode on a multi-meter you also run the risk of putting a low resistance load on power supply pins and causing a short. In voltage mode touching the two power pins is fine since it is a high resistance load in that mode, as long as you don't slip and bridge the positive and negative pins with the probe itself (poof!).
I don't disagree entirely with Derek. You're going to be flying relatively close in and light sport only so the chances of a drop out are low. However, the reliability of an orangeRx in a relatively vibration prone heli (compared to a foamie plane at least), with more carbon and other materials to reduce signal strength, with a lot of more weight in play and much higher money investment is my concern. If you have a quality sat on there, in addition to the built in antenna, then you should be okay. Like I said, I'd be doing frequent range checks and control checks before flights to make sure all is well before spinning it up. Make sure the Tx is charged up pretty well before flights too.
I don't disagree entirely with Derek. You're going to be flying relatively close in and light sport only so the chances of a drop out are low. However, the reliability of an orangeRx in a relatively vibration prone heli (compared to a foamie plane at least), with more carbon and other materials to reduce signal strength, with a lot of more weight in play and much higher money investment is my concern. If you have a quality sat on there, in addition to the built in antenna, then you should be okay. Like I said, I'd be doing frequent range checks and control checks before flights to make sure all is well before spinning it up. Make sure the Tx is charged up pretty well before flights too.
Derek
Well-Known Member
Ok, I have to agree 100% with Paul, on this one. I have zero carbon fiber on my foam board planes. You will have quite a bit of carbon fiber. I have, I think, very low vibrations on my foam board planes. You will have quite a few vibrations. Definitely do the range checks. A heli of this size and nature should have very regular range checks done anyway. Bill, take Paul's advice deeply to heart. My 7 foam board planes (the 7 with electronics) don't cost as much, as a whole, as your helicopter will cost in the end. I think you would be much happier with a quality rx on board your project.
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Stambo
Well-Known Member
I probably have to agree with these guys and qualify my earlier post by saying "as a temporary measure it will probably be all right for some preliminary flight testing."
For the long term safety of you, your family, any innocent bystanders, and the considerable investment in your machine, some better equipment should be a priority as funds allow.
These things can be lethal if something goes wrong.
For the long term safety of you, your family, any innocent bystanders, and the considerable investment in your machine, some better equipment should be a priority as funds allow.
These things can be lethal if something goes wrong.
Bill, I don't recall you saying if you would be doing this or not: will you by flying the frame before installing it into the fuselage? It's a good way to shake out electronics and other items, and find vibrations, prior to getting it into a fuselage when it can become difficult to repair or replace a bearing or other component. It will also give you a chance to fly a larger airframe heli and get used to the size and noise and all that before putting the fuselage at risk. You could even go the extra step of installing the naza equipment and fly that on the airframe without fuse as a second phase, before going to the full build.
Just an idea. If this was already in your plans, great. Sorry if I missed/forgot it.
Just an idea. If this was already in your plans, great. Sorry if I missed/forgot it.
billryalls
Member
I got some great news Spektrum fixed my receiver for free and is sending it back as soon as I call and pay shipping! haha too cool! You didnt miss anything Paul and I LOVE your advice!! I am going to buy the landing gear for the Swift NX 600 and it should mount right up letting me test this before fuse install, I DID, however, install it for a photo op and spin it up just to make sure all electrics were right and it did great here are the pics. I will now take mechanics b ack out and wait for Spektrum Rx and do the test flying Paul mentions.
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OH, one other big problem that should be and easy fix...the landing gear folds up (when out) way too easy as if the springs were just WAY too weak. Im afraid this thing will bottom out upon landing with these retracts. I love that they retract so dont want to make them rigid permanent but what might i look into?
- - - Updated - - -
OH, one other big problem that should be and easy fix...the landing gear folds up (when out) way too easy as if the springs were just WAY too weak. Im afraid this thing will bottom out upon landing with these retracts. I love that they retract so dont want to make them rigid permanent but what might i look into?